Eltsur Development Thread

Vaya · **Joined:** May 2009 **Posts:** 1848 **Location:**

Atibu wrote:

1) Overlimit had a working bot from the start (not debatable)
2) I'm quite sure that salvation had over 50% closet botters
3) Myth was unpacked in less than a day

There is only one server that had a 0% bot/legit ratio, and remember what happened with that one

We were the only ones that had a botless server, so I am one of the only 3 people that can actually participate in this discussion, and I can tell you for a fact, botless servers do not work. There are simply not enough legit players to make a legit server economically viable (nobody is going to pay for a server with 50 active players), you can say 'but hey atibu, salvation had enough moneyz!!!', that was more than 2 years ago, and even they had to close after a relatively shot period, even if they said they had 'more t han enough money to keep the server running for 10 years'.

Things change, Venture was one of the most advanced servers of its time, yet the main sugestion we got was 'allow bots'

So I suggest you get that perfect idea of a botless server out of your head, it's simply not possible for a number of reasons:

*Not enough legit players
*Nobody actually knows how to block all bots
*99% of the pservers are made by some random people that live in a third world country (egypt/turkey) hoping to get some quick cash

/rant

you guys play on random servers like Theta, which are the complete opposite (goldbots, moneycow, pay2win), whose admins don't even know how to enable windows firewall, yet I don't hear anybody complaining about those servers

inb4 venture suxx
inb4 srf is actually owned by egyptians

Is it me, or you like adding your server to every discussion?

Tasdik · **Joined:** Jan 2007 **Posts:** 13205 **Location:** Life

He does seem to be, a bit.

Which would be fine, assuming he actually had plans to start it back up.

But he's made it clear that isn't the case, so I don't really see the point.

Also; Atibu, you greatly exaggerate this whole "We fixed every bug" thing on your server. I tested it, and discovered that wasn't the case.

Valtaur · **Joined:** Mar 2014 **Posts:** 17 **Location:** Silkroad

Just some notes to avoid confusion:

-Goldbotting will be useless, items you will find sell for little gold (just enough to buy basic items), however you will gain enough gold through the quest system

-elixers will not drop in the normal world, so you will not be confronted with market saturation or global spam, nor will people be able to use an autofuser 24/7. However there are daily quests where you can get exilirs, and you will also be able to get them from the instances. Since there's going to be less elixirs in the game, to balance it out monsters will drop a lot more higher + items aswell as alchemy rates are going to be balanced to be worth collecting the elixirs.

So all these things combined will make sure the game is fun for everybody, yes bots will gain the levels, but without actually playing the game you will not be able to upgrade your gear or even reach the cap. The argument that bots will still be favoured is simply not true, legit players can start building their endgame gear while leveling, while bots will need to do double work (where the latter is unbottable :sohappy:

)

XMoshe · **Posted:** Fri Mar 21, 2014 10:22 pm

Tasdik wrote:

He does seem to be, a bit.

Which would be fine, assuming he actually had plans to start it back up.

But he's made it clear that isn't the case, so I don't really see the point.

Also; Atibu, you greatly exaggerate this whole "We fixed every bug" thing on your server. I tested it, and discovered that wasn't the case.

True or not keep that discussion out of this thread. Atibu made a good point, and if he made it using his own server as reference let him do that.

I'd love to see the final product. I could even help test it at some point. My main concern is still the 'if it looks too good to be true, it's probably not true' saying.

Also I haven't spend much time thinking about it but as it sits right now, I can't think of any 'balanced' way to introduce rebirthing. Anything that would make it worthwhile gives people an advantage.

HyperBunny · **Joined:** Feb 2014 **Posts:** 158 **Location:** ┻━┻

Pardon my ignorance but what the hell is "rebirth" in sro...?

As for the server, well, the mind-numbing grinding was one of the worst parts of sro for me and having botters ks your shit while you stagger to get any little bit out of an enemy before they take it is just not my idea of fun.

Being capped in a day isn't fun either mind you.

Tasdik · **Joined:** Jan 2007 **Posts:** 13205 **Location:** Life

Rebirth: You cap, then reset to 0, cap again, get some sort of reward, repeatxinfinity.

HyperBunny · **Joined:** Feb 2014 **Posts:** 158 **Location:** ┻━┻

Tasdik wrote:

Rebirth: You cap, then reset to 0, cap again, get some sort of reward, repeatxinfinity.

Ah, figured it might be something like that. Wait, oh god, who would do that in isro?! Assuming it's in isro.

omier · **Joined:** Aug 2006 **Posts:** 5985 **Location:** ...

HyperBunny wrote:

Tasdik wrote:

Rebirth: You cap, then reset to 0, cap again, get some sort of reward, repeatxinfinity.

Ah, figured it might be something like that. Wait, oh god, who would do that in isro?! Assuming it's in isro.

It's not in ISRO. That would be even more horrible.

HyperBunny · **Joined:** Feb 2014 **Posts:** 158 **Location:** ┻━┻

Sanktum wrote:

HyperBunny wrote:

Tasdik wrote:

Rebirth: You cap, then reset to 0, cap again, get some sort of reward, repeatxinfinity.

Ah, figured it might be something like that. Wait, oh god, who would do that in isro?! Assuming it's in isro.

It's not in ISRO. That would be even more horrible.

Agreed but I imagine that would be quite the money maker with premiums.

Atibu · **Joined:** Jul 2009 **Posts:** 548 **Location:** //////

Tasdik wrote:

Also; Atibu, you greatly exaggerate this whole "We fixed every bug" thing on your server. I tested it, and discovered that wasn't the case.

like what?

XMoshe · **Posted:** Sat Mar 22, 2014 1:18 pm

A server I played on for 1-1.5 years had a rebirth system. You'd get 5 extra stat points for every rebirth you did to distribute. The cap was 1500 rb (rebirths) when I quite.

With the gear they sold and devils we made, we walked around with nearly 900k hp.

That's why I'm so curious as to what reward you're planning on giving rbers. It has to be unique or you'd just grind for it but it can't be giving an advantage if you want to keep the balance as you say. I just don't see any reason to rb except for becoming stronger than during your last rb.

Vaya · **Joined:** May 2009 **Posts:** 1848 **Location:**

Eyecandy would be perfect reward, looking better with no extra power

Or extra power buff for a short period, you need to rebirth again to regain it

byourdi · **Posted:** Sat Mar 22, 2014 10:13 pm

venture sucked dick anyway. so does sro

Valtaur · **Joined:** Mar 2014 **Posts:** 17 **Location:** Silkroad

Updated the facebook page, if you want to know more about our new instances, make sure to check it out!

We've been brainstorming about the rebirth incentives the last few days, we've come up with some nice ideas. There is no need to worry, it will be purely cosmetical, while still being very attractive :sohappy:

_MvP_ · **Joined:** Jan 2009 **Posts:** 1423 **Location:**

What exactly did you do to balance china and euros? That 10% damage buff doesnt cut it.

Here is something I liked from some other thread. Its just idea.

Nitro wrote:

My try:
- buff removal skills :: Able to remove powerful buffs like bless / skins / healing cycle / fences / quota which will harm euros greatly,
but won't affect chinese much.
- fast piercing armor ignoring damage :: China class could easily pot-out that, but euros could find trouble due to armor ignoring damage

This was just his suggestion for something else, but I think it could work here.

Valtaur · **Joined:** Mar 2014 **Posts:** 17 **Location:** Silkroad

_MvP_ wrote:

What exactly did you do to balance china and euros? That 10% damage buff doesnt cut it.

Here is something I liked from some other thread. Its just idea.

Nitro wrote:

My try:
- buff removal skills :: Able to remove powerful buffs like bless / skins / healing cycle / fences / quota which will harm euros greatly,
but won't affect chinese much.
- fast piercing armor ignoring damage :: China class could easily pot-out that, but euros could find trouble due to armor ignoring damage

This was just his suggestion for something else, but I think it could work here.

Skills are pretty balanced since we're using venture v2 files (which got a lot of positive feedback, and has been tested in the wild)

_MvP_ · **Joined:** Jan 2009 **Posts:** 1423 **Location:**

Valtaur wrote:

_MvP_ wrote:

What exactly did you do to balance china and euros? That 10% damage buff doesnt cut it.

Here is something I liked from some other thread. Its just idea.

Nitro wrote:

My try:
- buff removal skills :: Able to remove powerful buffs like bless / skins / healing cycle / fences / quota which will harm euros greatly,
but won't affect chinese much.
- fast piercing armor ignoring damage :: China class could easily pot-out that, but euros could find trouble due to armor ignoring damage

This was just his suggestion for something else, but I think it could work here.

Skills are pretty balanced since we're using venture v2 files (which got a lot of positive feedback, and has been tested in the wild)

Can you post whats changed? I never played venture v2 files.

Valtaur · **Joined:** Mar 2014 **Posts:** 17 **Location:** Silkroad

_MvP_ wrote:

Valtaur wrote:

_MvP_ wrote:

What exactly did you do to balance china and euros? That 10% damage buff doesnt cut it.

Here is something I liked from some other thread. Its just idea.

This was just his suggestion for something else, but I think it could work here.

Skills are pretty balanced since we're using venture v2 files (which got a lot of positive feedback, and has been tested in the wild)

Can you post whats changed? I never played venture v2 files.

There are too many changes to list at the moment, I will post a list when we get closer to the release date, but it's balanced overal.

Also an extra note: we adjusted the leveling curve from 60-80 to make sure it doesn't scale so exponentially anymore :sohappy:

omier · **Joined:** Aug 2006 **Posts:** 5985 **Location:** ...

Valtaur wrote:

Also an extra note: we adjusted the leveling curve from 60-80 to make sure it doesn't scale so exponentially anymore :sohappy:

Nice. I'd like a more steady curve for sub-60 levels too.

Spiritual · **Joined:** Sep 2009 **Posts:** 274 **Location:** Finland

The way you approach your customers is something which should be the standard in the p-server scene. :thumbs up: However, your window is rapidly closing. Skalidor 2 a.k.a Elamidas is rumored to open during April. This basically means that if you launch just before/after them, there's a high risk your hard work goes down the drain due to obvious reasons.

XMoshe · **Posted:** Fri Apr 04, 2014 3:01 pm

Spiritual wrote:

The way you approach your customers is something which should be the standard in the p-server scene. :thumbs up: However, your window is rapidly closing. Skalidor 2 a.k.a Elamidas is rumored to open during April. This basically means that if you launch just before/after them, there's a high risk your hard work goes down the drain due to obvious reasons.

I just have to ask, why are you so sure that server will attract so many people?

Sephuku · **Posted:** Fri Apr 04, 2014 6:48 pm

XMoshe wrote:

Spiritual wrote:

The way you approach your customers is something which should be the standard in the p-server scene. :thumbs up: However, your window is rapidly closing. Skalidor 2 a.k.a Elamidas is rumored to open during April. This basically means that if you launch just before/after them, there's a high risk your hard work goes down the drain due to obvious reasons.

I just have to ask, why are you so sure that server will attract so many people?

Because Skalidor had a peak of 2200 players at some point. They simply lost them because there was no player retention. That and the gold exploits.

XMoshe · **Posted:** Fri Apr 04, 2014 8:24 pm

Sephuku wrote:

XMoshe wrote:

Spiritual wrote:

The way you approach your customers is something which should be the standard in the p-server scene. :thumbs up: However, your window is rapidly closing. Skalidor 2 a.k.a Elamidas is rumored to open during April. This basically means that if you launch just before/after them, there's a high risk your hard work goes down the drain due to obvious reasons.

I just have to ask, why are you so sure that server will attract so many people?

Because Skalidor had a peak of 2200 players at some point. They simply lost them because there was no player retention. That and the gold exploits.

The past doesn't garantuee succes in the future =p But if that's 2200 unique players then yes that is quite impressive.

Spiritual · **Joined:** Sep 2009 **Posts:** 274 **Location:** Finland

XMoshe wrote:

I just have to ask, why are you so sure that server will attract so many people?

While it had its own flaws, the activity was really high for many weeks, it ran smooth after the rough start, GMs were active and there was a good amount of content. First server I played over 1 month after salvation (played for 2 months in total).

Of course the 2200 was not the amount of unique ips. However, 500+ real players is nowadays a pretty good achievement considering most server owners are happy when they have couple hundred with 3 ip limit at the launch...

jbrigjaj · **Posted:** Sun Apr 13, 2014 7:15 am

First of all I'm VERY much interested in this server for major reasons.

Like posted above we simply cannot have a proper server with just legits BUT, if an incentive to play legit is given that proves the botters that, "Hey, you can bot but you'd gain more playing yourself".

I'm really outdated on the power of these bots, I've designed scripts and botting clients for other games and something that was always hard for us to tackle was dynamic dungeons, dynamic/event quests as this would cause the bot to be open to so many possible bugs(That eventually did occur). So why not create such scenarios which reward players greatly which requires;

- Teamwork
- Proper party setups
- Strong communication(Vent)

Which can directly reward players evenly with a token system(Similar to Salvation) or give it chance for good loot. Also, work on the job system to make it ever so more interesting, if all succeeds, this server will be just what we need, breathe of fresh air.

Battling bots isn't too hard, if you need any help on ideas, I'll try my best

EDIT: Just realised this thread is relatively dead

Valtaur · **Joined:** Mar 2014 **Posts:** 17 **Location:** Silkroad

jbrigjaj wrote:

First of all I'm VERY much interested in this server for major reasons.

Like posted above we simply cannot have a proper server with just legits BUT, if an incentive to play legit is given that proves the botters that, "Hey, you can bot but you'd gain more playing yourself".

I'm really outdated on the power of these bots, I've designed scripts and botting clients for other games and something that was always hard for us to tackle was dynamic dungeons, dynamic/event quests as this would cause the bot to be open to so many possible bugs(That eventually did occur). So why not create such scenarios which reward players greatly which requires;

- Teamwork
- Proper party setups
- Strong communication(Vent)

Which can directly reward players evenly with a token system(Similar to Salvation) or give it chance for good loot. Also, work on the job system to make it ever so more interesting, if all succeeds, this server will be just what we need, breathe of fresh air.

Battling bots isn't too hard, if you need any help on ideas, I'll try my best

EDIT: Just realised this thread is relatively dead

Thanks for your interest, I can assure you that the project is certainly not dead, but we have been working tremendously on our last features. It is exactly what we'd like to have on our server, we'd like to mix basic silkroad elements that are fun for everybody, with actual teamplay during instances and the triangular conflict system!

In the meantime, we have updated our facebook and twitter pages, as we are getting closer to launch :sohappy:

https://www.facebook.com/EltsurOnline
https://twitter.com/eltsuronline

jbrigjaj · **Posted:** Sun Apr 13, 2014 2:04 pm

Glad it's still going on! All I ask is to devote a solid amount of time to make it worth it, if it presents balanced system then everybody will join in

If you need help with ideas or anything feel free to add me on Skype @ bucial11

Bananaman · **Posted:** Wed Apr 16, 2014 5:56 pm

Wow this sounds like you're workign to fix a lot of the major problems with SRO as a whole, Kind of a "find the root cause of the disease" kind of thing. Very intresting...

Will you guys have battle arenas as well? I loved that aspect of it, Hell I twould be awesome if you could just Battle arena your way to progression if you dont want to grind mobs a lot.

Anyway its nice to see someone who actually gets it.

jbrigjaj · **Posted:** Wed Apr 16, 2014 7:49 pm

Yea seems very promising and definitely going to try it. Feel free to try AinoSRO. We're gathering up a bit over there

sibiumarius · **Joined:** Apr 2008 **Posts:** 577 **Location:** London

Bananaman wrote:

Wow this sounds like you're workign to fix a lot of the major problems with SRO as a whole, Kind of a "find the root cause of the disease" kind of thing. Very intresting...

Will you guys have battle arenas as well? I loved that aspect of it, Hell I twould be awesome if you could just Battle arena your way to progression if you dont want to grind mobs a lot.

Anyway its nice to see someone who actually gets it.

dudeeeee , long time no see ...

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