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Go read up about the "Great Society plan" and things such as the "New Deal"

Like LBJ said, “I’ll have those ***** voting Democratic for the next 200 years.” and he wasn't lying. Why would someone choose to earn something when it's much easier to have it handed to you..

This whole "fair share" argument is complete crap. Tax law is simply to insight class warfare. If you're in poverty in this country, you still have it better than any other 3rd world country.. I know plenty of people around here, who have never worked a day in their life, but they still collect food stamps and other welfare, but they can still afford to own a new car, latest cell phone, nice clothing, and eat out... If that's poverty, please let me in on that.. I guess I wasn't raised with this kind of sense of entitlement if I wanted something, I had to find a job to earn the money to get what I desired. I never expected my neighbor to pay for anything for me. I don't know how you come to the conclusion that anyone in this world owes you a damn thing when you have not earned anything, but hey, legal plunder is all the rage...

Just curious, how many of these people living on food stamps volunteer their time to their community? None of my buddies at the two fire departments I volunteer at are on any kind of government assistance, yet they still feel the need to give back to their community. So my question is, why does it make the upper class greedy/evil for not giving their earned money to people that haven't earned it, but it not greedy for someone to collect a Farking check every month and contribute absolutely nothing... Hey I'll call you next time a poor man gives me a job.. Other wise I'm gonna keep my damn mouth shut and thank God, my boss is generous enough to give me the opportunity to make money.

Anyways, I was raised mostly by my single mother who couldn't hold down a job. We never had a place to stay, in and out of trailers, apartments, and homeless shelters(church & community). My older brother and I didn't get kids meals.. MacNcheese was the shit for us, but we usually had to eat rice and or beans and canned foods. We got clothes donated from local churches. Coming from that, and getting old enough to actually make a living, and put myself through school and provide for my own family.. I don't think anyone owes me a thing, if anything I owe my country.

Because people like this still exist and their political outlet is the republicans.


Fiction is represented by the Reps. Why would black people vote for a party that has people like fiction as it's base.

though putting yourself through college with nothing but your own pocket money. That's impressive.

I'd rather live in a world full of the people that fictions described. Than the alternative.

Was no one besides me taught to share? This isnt an aguement over the rich owing the poor it's about a society working together to better the lives of everyone.

"To collect a check and contribute nothing" to you fiction that is describing someone on welfare to me that's describing the owner of a large company who gets payed to do press conferences and play golf.

Don't get me wrong I think there should be welfare reform, you should have to take a drug test and do volunteer work for the community but I don't think all of these people are the terrors described by fiction.

And thats why the Reps lost this election. Because their base believes the things that fiction says are true among other ridiculous things. They believe so much that life is the way they see it that they alienate the rest of the country and even the entire world. People were throwing parties all over the planet for Obama. He's a hit internationally for reasons why his base is so large and diverse at home. But the reps look at that and go well ofc black voted for the guy who will give them more welfare. welfare is what black people want. they certainly don't want jobs or a political candidate who doesn't think they're dirty moocher. nope. definitely the welfare checks.

It's ok though. this self destruction is a necessary processes to bring forth change as evident by 3 states voting to legalize gay marriage and 1 state blocking an attempt to outlaw it. Something that goes against the running position of EVERY rep candidate.

come. sit and listen tasdik. fiction.

This is fucking amazing.

To the response that, the way I grew up is selfish... (For one I am in no way a republican nor do I support that party) I run into burning buildings to save people I have never met...(When my pager goes off, the only thing I know is if it's a car wreck, house fire, or brush fire.. I don't know if I'm going to have to get to the 2nd story to save a child or if I'm gonna see someone decapitated in a car accident, but because I believe I should willfully give back to my community, I continue to volunteer) This is the first time I've been considered selfish for doing so, less you ask my wife. lol I'm from Houston, and I did grow up with the "get it how you live crowd" as well, the type to go rob a convenient store, or pickpocket someone.

Aventus confuses people who sit on their ass and collect a check with people who've built an empire-which gives millions of other people the opportunity to make something of themselves-and collect a check from their determination and hard work. Give me an example of Romney being born with a spoon in his mouth, and I'll ask you why you don't give your money to someone less fortunate.. You've got a computer, and internet, you can obviously donate stuff to someone who -like me- grew up with none of that.

I was taught to share(hints why I give so much of my time to my community) but I was also taught not to steal... redistribution of wealth through government("Legal plunder") or criminal action(robbin hood"illegal plunder") is one in the same. You are taking money from people who have earned it, and giving it to those who have not.

Well I do donate a bit of my money to help those in need, I also actively volunteer to help communities.

I guess what it comes down to is I see how this government money is helping people and your looking at it as these people are to damn lazy and just wont work.

Now you said you grew up a shit life, now I'm sure at some point you got government aid does that make your mother a lazy slob who wants nothing more than to collect money from the government?



Lastly I don't confuse those people, I just don't see the difference between the two.

Edit: I do not hate all successful business people, the ones I dislike are the selfish and greedy ones who are to pompous to help anyone besides themselves. If corporate billionaires would give back to the people than we wouldn't need as much government spending to support them. Hell if those guys weren't so focused on the bottom line than they could employ the nation instead of employing china, mexico, and many other countries other than us.

That's why I respect someone as wealthy as bill gates, he supports higher tax-rates on himself and still gives millions to charities. He also came from a respectable start. If you came from rich and built an empire it is nowhere near as impressive.

I can't be selfish, i'm a firefighter.

Jeez the mental loops you go through to justify how big of a dick you are fiction. It's hilarious.

Fiction puts his life on the line to help strangers on a regular basis or no pay what so ever. The only person who looks like a dick here, is you, man sex.

"Good" people can still be dicks.

I'm not exactly referring to you Fiction. Just saiyan

Nah, Gaige is correct. There are a lot of vollies that can be dicks, not really as much as some of the paid fighters, but yeah. I'm not trying to be a dick, or anything either. The point I was making was simply that I worked my way up from poverty, and didn't expect anyone to hand me a thing, and I still feel I owe my country, instead of expecting my country to hand me everything. -edit- Yes my mother did receive certain benefits(insurance from my father's death, and food stamps), but I can assure you, most of it went to her dead beat boyfriends. Which was more often than not to fuel their drug addiction or buy alcohol. -- Though I come off a bit of a jerk, it's just I feel strongly on the issue, and I see so many people that didn't have it half as bad as my situation, and here they are begging for my hard earned money, without even putting in any kind of effort. Basically to sum it up. 10k plys!

Now here's what I'm not talking about.. I'm not talking about someone who has cancer and cannot function or someone who lost a leg in the war, or better yet, born with a disability, etc etc. I'm talking about the majority that I see that simply aren't willing to get out and bust their ass to make a living, or that can't get out and make a living because they'd lose all their government benefits and actually make less working than they would from welfare. The government needs to stop taking that money out of people's pockets to begin with, and let the people who earned it, keep it, and spend how they decide(speaking on income tax, not sales tax or other levies.) Government does not know best. We're taxed on everything we do, we can't even work without being taxed, and yet the government still cannot put out a balanced budget... Stop the policing of the world, endless wars, stop this drug war, stop getting involved in moral/social matters, and stop this welfare state. The culture has to change, people have to feel like they can make something of themselves, and they don't need to be dependent on a handout.

One other thing, the rich create wealth in this country. Entrepreneur are the reason we have the things we have today, capitalism has sped up the advancement in technology tremendously. Every time the rich build a new building, yacht or golf course, or buy a Ferrari, etc, that's putting money back into the economy(somebody has to build these things, somebody has to take care of these things, all job creators), so as greedy as they seem(it's their money they earned), they're still helping the country grow.

I agree with you there. well, It doesn't necessarily "apply to every rich person."
But when the rich "take advantage of the poor"... grinding them down financially, socially etc..
That's farked up

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Normally don't agree with her but she's right.

Yeah I saw that one too lol

What does "take advantage of the poor" mean? If you mean that rich people somehow force poor people to work for them for menial wages or use poor people to get where they are, that doesn't really happen..most rich people became rich because they worked hard in an honest way.

Rich people help the economy because they are rich. Anyone who climbs the ladder in a capitalist society is a benefit to society (more taxes for government, more jobs for others - especially if they own a business, etc)

but the republican argument that cutting taxes for the rich is somehow going to raise more revenue or have more money to hire more people is really stupid. Not every rich person is a business owner. Many rich people are privately rich through their personal successes - doctors, lawyers, etc. Why they'd be happy to have a tax cut - more money to send to their hedge fund managers. That doesn't help someone get employed does it?

The gov't kept food on your table. The gov't gave you an education. The gov't gave you working roads and power grids and transportation systems. The gov't paid for your college if you went because even if you paid it off entirely on your own from loans those loans are subsidized and your school was subsidized because all colleges in the this country are. The gov't subsidizes the farmers that put the food on your table now. The gov't pays for your fire company so you have the option to volunteer. The whole, I pulled myself up by my own bootstraps mentality is ridiculous, especially in this country because in this country the gov't takes care of everyone. You weren't complaining that gov't was overstepping itself when it was keeping you alive and giving you a mind so you could grow into something but now that you have you feel like you suddenly have the vantage point that you didn't before. Suddenly the gov't is taking too much even though taxes on the wealthy are at the lowest they have ever been in the history of this country.

Somehow from the 1850s-1950s when the people who built this country flourished creating empires of vast wealth and monopolies that threatened the balance of the world, somehow they did mind paying those extreme taxes and it didn't cut jobs everywhere and we didn't slid into recession and they didn't all flee the country to build somewhere else. Somehow the most powerful country in the world sprang up. Somehow people felt like they could do and be anything. Somehow the American dream that is iconic today was born. They would laugh at the 1% complaining about their tax rates because they are absurdly low. They would laugh at you defending them because they don't need it. Trickle down does not exist. That's a fact that's been disproved time and time again.

Also you're a racist simple and plain. I'm just putting that on the table so it's established. A long time ago I used to act extra nice because i knew that as a black guy people were judging me and I didn't want their negative experience with me to be used to judge my entire race and I hoped that by showing them a positive experience they would use that to judge my entire race. They could go home and say "honey, there are actually some decent black people out their, i met one today." But eventually i realized that those people who would look at one person or even a small group of people and judge them all to be a certain way, to deny that all people are individuals who dream and want desire and fail and have faults, those people would not be moved by my small efforts because their minds were too small and narrow to begin with.

That is racism. It's a weight that crushes down on the whole of society building pressure in people and places that manifest in all kinds of ways. The people who push and the people who are pushed are both victims and they've been victims for so long in this country they don't even realize it. It's internalized in the way we speak and the way we think and the way we look at one another. Your existence makes me more sad than angry because I know that the subtleties and complexities that have lead you to this cannot be undone so easily if at all. And you will teach it to your children even if you don't mean to. And somewhere some other little person will feel the weight of all society pushing down on them and they may not realize what is happening and have the clarity to remove themselves from it.

Lmao XemnasXD, shut the hell up... Me a racist? GTFO haha Sounds to me like the only racist here would be the one implying that I'm talking about a specific race being bad for this country or being lazy... I don't give a shit what color your skin is, if you're lazy, you're lazy... if you're a dead beat, you're dead beat, black, white, brown, yellow... who cares.

And no, the government didn't pay for my college... I had to work my ass off pipe lining and taking it one semester at a time. Basically... Your thoughts are summed up with this quote by Frederic Bastiat:

“Socialism, like the ancient ideas from which it springs, confuses the distinction between government and society. As a result of this, every time we object to a thing being done by government, the socialists conclude that we object to its being done at all. We disapprove of state education. Then the socialists say that we are opposed to any education. We object to a state religion. Then the socialists say that we want no religion at all. We object to a state-enforced equality. Then they say that we are against equality. And so on, and so on. It is as if the socialists were to accuse us of not wanting persons to eat because we do not want the state to raise grain.”

... Your mind set is what's wrong with this country. I bust my ass, pay my taxes(yes we are way over taxed), raise my family, teach my little girl respect(no matter race), give back to my community, and do all this honestly according to the state, and your stupid ass still has the nerve to try and make me look evil.. Yeah, Tasdik had it 100% on this one, you are a dick.

--edit-- I'm sorry, I'm not usually one to personally attack someone over political discussion, but this is ridiculous... XemnasXD can do nothing but try and use personal attacks to lessen my meaning, and it's just a typical strategy, always play the race card, belittle, marginalize, or just spin shit... I'm tired of having straight talk(not gay bashing) with this pseudo-intellectual.

A little reflection after that win.. I don't really like using pics unless I'm being sarcastic, but this sums it up, even though there's so much more to be said.

Yes, do justify it, it's only in your nature of not having a spine, to do so. =P (Dick move)

It does happen. The poor will work a hard day to have enough to eat. The rich have been taking advantage of this fact since the beginning of time. No?

No.

Maybe in different way? xD

Maybe I should take time to actually read this thread since it always come up in my feed.

It would be helpful if they actually payed what they owed in taxes instead of sending their money out to Swiss bank accounts.


@Fiction shut up with that we are over taxed bullshit, you know it's bullshit just as much as I do. Look at northern European taxes and Canadian taxes then complain. The government needs to tax it's people in order to function. Without taxes you don't have a functioning government as shown under the Articles in early american history as I'm sure you know.

What this country needs is middle ground, as much as I'd love to live in a Marxist nation the chances of that happening are slim to none and as much as many people would love to live in a full blown laissez faire capitalistic nation that also will never happen. Neither of those has a chance in hell of working and that's why it never has.

In the country we need a progressive tax and to close loopholes for the ones up top. We also need to put way higher tariffs of china. Welfare reform along with healthcare reform but the problem lies in society, people aren't willing to compromise or wait for progress. In 2009 there were many tea party congress people who said no matter what was brought to congress by Obama they would shoot it down in an instant.

Arguing about dem v repub or dem v libertarian will never go anywhere. You choose your political party based off of life experiences and how you were raised. I was raised to know that all people are equal and no one should ever have to suffer in life others weren't raised that way so me arguing them to come to my side is pointless.





Lastly just because someone says they hate welfare doesn't mean they are racist, especially since a large majority of people on social support systems are white.
I for one know there needs to be reform in unemployment and welfare due to my uncle, he's a black man but that's not the point, the point is he is the laziest and most selfish man on the planet. I don't see him as a steaming pile of shit because he is black I see it that way because he abuses the system and still doesn't take care of his kids.

So to an extent Fiction is right.

TL;DR
The country isn't farked because of the government it's farked because of the mentality of the people. After all this is a government for the people and by the people.

I will say this, I'm not opposed to helping out those who actually need help. But I hate that we support people whose poor financial decisions are the reason why they are on welfare. For instance, I have a coworker who's a single mother of two. Because of this, the government actually pays for her rent every month. Now, while that may seem reasonable, but I think it's ridiculous that because she frequently has sex with numerous guys, which eventually led to her getting pregnant, our tax money is now paying for her apartment.

That's dumb.

That's where it gets tricky, the money should technically be used for the kids but more than likely it won't be used for just them. That's a societal problem not a problem with the system.

Honestly, the best way to solve this whole "welfare" problem would be to have it done a smalle scale. Talking like state, or even each city. Because while you may not know everyone's story in the entire world. You're pretty damn likely to know the story of your neighbor. And whether or not he actually needs/deserves financial help, or not.

I agree that it should be done more locally because then the government wouldn't be blindly sending out paychecks.

On a semi related note, I actually plan on doin something similar with my family. There's 9 of us siblings, and once we all get decent paying jobs, we're going to set up a fund to which we donate a certain amount of our income to, effectively creating an emergency fund, should one of us fall on hard times. Kind of excited about it.

I don't think it's a stretch to say who the someone is in that response as the question was specifically about black people, and then you went on to quote LBJ talking specifically about black people. Do you even read what you type? This is twice where you have completely contradicted what you stated. Now you're looking around like omg mansex where are these accusations coming from!?




Also name the college you went to and i'll go pull up how much gov't funding it receives per year so that whatever tuition you paid would be lower and they could afford the teacher and supplies that educated you. You like to think that you did it all on your own but you didn't and that's the mentality that is wrong imo. I understand that's extremely subjective but you actively ignore the contribution of the gov't and therefore all of society when it comes to your education, insisting that it was all you you you by yourself with nobody looking over your shoulder when that just isn't true.

I voted for Obama because he doesn't hate gay people, he thinks a woman's body is her own business and he realizes that college tuition and medical fees are going to crush two separate generations at the same time. He realizes that America needs to change the way it handles education and start treating science seriously, that we don't have the engineers or chemist or biologist or physicist to keep up with the rest of the world and those people can come from all paths of life not just the ones who can afford it.

He's not perfect and he's done a lot of harm in some other areas but the alternative was Romney would do just as bad in those same areas and then **** up all of the above as well.

Also your paper is joke. Are they really crying a river about Anwar al-Aulaqi? The NDAA is mostly the budget of the defense department with some extra evil nuggets tacked on it's passed every year by every president. So Hank Paulson has connections with Goldman Sachs, i'm pretty sure just about every guy who has held that post in the past decade has had connections to banks? What do libya, pakistan, syria, and yemen all have in common? They have a lot of stuff in common, which is the insidious thing that Obama is responsible for and him alone?

Was that supposed to open my eyes or something? Cause it seemed like something a college freshman would post on 4chan and then call for a raid of the white house. It's just dumb. You can't name a single president who hasn't issued coups, bombed civilians, started a war, invaded a country, oppressed people home and abroad. That comes with the territory almost. The only idiots who would be shocked and moved by that paper are the type of idiots who think it's shocking and eye opening to post it on forums. I'm almost certain that's how it found it's way here. I imagine when you read that you were like MAN OBAMA! GRRR! SINCE I DIDN'T KNOW THIS SHIT I BET NOBODY KNOWS THIS SHIT!


god you are some type of stupid aren't you...


also just to nitpick everyone takes it one semester at a time, no one is taking two semesters at once...

that was just me being a dick but the rest of the post is legit.


@tasdick welfare is handled on the local level. There is no gov't office in washington that blindly mails all the welfare checks. The money is given to the states and the states put it into local offices that evaluate people, homes, living conditions, etc. Because the process is actually local there often aren't enough people to do the job resulting in social workers being overworked while still being underpayed. It's a notoriously unrewarding job considering the amount of effort that goes into it.