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nightbloom
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Post subject: Posted: Sat Jun 30, 2007 8:59 am |
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Joined: Jan 2006 Posts: 5492 Location:
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cin wrote: nightbloom wrote: cin wrote: nightbloom wrote: SuicideGrl wrote: Altering the SRO client is against the ToS. there is so much that is being done today to work around elements of the SRO client that policy has not been able to keep up. as a general rule, anything that alters the game client is forbidden on these forums. Somehow crackpot programs for nude chars and unique locations doesnt fall into this category. did you actually read this topic? the files are pk2 files, not client modifications as you insinuated. both are client based so you will see them on only your screen. and if you are so sure that you know they are illegal, could you please link me to wherever it sais so on the official site? because that would mean that we would have to delete all those topics in this forum right now. Im sure that when JoyMax implemented the nude patch, it only applied to those unable to alter their files and fix it. Your wisdom is infinite. your wisdom seems to be infinite too. but you still havent answered my question. could you link me to wherever it sais on the official site that client based pk2 edits are illegal?
The official site has no search engine of any kind. Finding anything in that mess is nearly impossible. Looking through 50 pages of "JoyMax sux!" to find one specific post even stumps my infamous memory.
_________________ <<banned from SRF for rules violations: being a constant problem. -SG>>
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DarkJackal
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Post subject: Posted: Sat Jun 30, 2007 9:28 am |
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Elite Member |
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Joined: Feb 2006 Posts: 6119 Location: A den~
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cin wrote: nightbloom wrote: SuicideGrl wrote: Altering the SRO client is against the ToS. there is so much that is being done today to work around elements of the SRO client that policy has not been able to keep up. as a general rule, anything that alters the game client is forbidden on these forums. Somehow crackpot programs for nude chars and unique locations doesnt fall into this category. did you actually read this topic? the files are pk2 files, not client modifications as you insinuated. both are client based so you will see them on only your screen. and if you are so sure that you know they are illegal, could you please link me to wherever it sais so on the official site? because that would mean that we would have to delete all those topics in this forum right now.
Uhh client side or any other kind of editing is still still editing, the end result is the same either way, i'm not trying to put it down or argue, my point is I don't think your right and i'd bet using it can get you banned :d.
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PR0METHEUS
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Post subject: Posted: Sat Jun 30, 2007 9:31 am |
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Senior Member |
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Joined: Aug 2006 Posts: 4093 Location: Earth
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cin wrote: nightbloom wrote: SuicideGrl wrote: Altering the SRO client is against the ToS. there is so much that is being done today to work around elements of the SRO client that policy has not been able to keep up. as a general rule, anything that alters the game client is forbidden on these forums. Somehow crackpot programs for nude chars and unique locations doesnt fall into this category. did you actually read this topic? the files are pk2 files, not client modifications as you insinuated. both are client based so you will see them on only your screen. and if you are so sure that you know they are illegal, could you please link me to wherever it sais so on the official site? because that would mean that we would have to delete all those topics in this forum right now.
I can definitely see nightbloom's point. The way I see it, any modification to any client-side SRO file is a modification to the client. The client is not just sro_client.exe. There's also silkroad.exe, media.pk2, data.pk2, and all the other files beneath C:\Program Files\Silkroad\. When you download the Silkroad Client, you get all those files. They're all part of the client. So in that regard, pk2 edits are client edits.
I guess the question is where do you draw the line? SuicideGrl did state that ANY modification to the client is illegal here (not those exact words), but it seems some client modifications are ok here. Some modifications are harmless from a gaming standpoint like removing character's clothing or making trees look like bushes. But things like changing the degree of weapons or making a thief suit look like a hunter ID, or adding spawn point dots to the maps for uniques can add more advantage over other players.
So where do you draw the line?
_________________ Missing the good times in SRO... 
SRO: 1x, STR Blader (Thebes) 54, STR blader (Venice) 0x, INT wizard (Venice) 19, INT spear (Venice) 34, STR rogue/bard (Venus) 0x, STR blader (Venus) 8x, INT bard/cleric (Gaia)
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cin
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Post subject: Posted: Sat Jun 30, 2007 9:39 am |
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PR0METHEUS wrote: I guess the question is where do you draw the line? SuicideGrl did state that ANY modification to the client is illegal here (not those exact words), but it seems some client modifications are ok here. Some modifications are harmless from a gaming standpoint like removing character's clothing or making trees look like bushes. But things like changing the degree of weapons or making a thief suit look like a hunter ID, or adding spawn point dots to the maps for uniques can add more advantage over other players.
So where do you draw the line?
i also think that is the hard part, but up to now, as far as i know there has
been no bans on pk2 edited files. the nude patch as a pk2 edit has been around
for quite a long time, and i havent heard anybody being banned for that.
still, joymax has not come with a proper explanation of what is wrong and
what is right. but like i first stated, download at own risk. i never took that
back
and yes. it is good that you all warn the people for this, but there have been
a lot of discussions on this point already. maybe it is good that this one got
out of hand 
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Demarthl
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Post subject: Posted: Sat Jun 30, 2007 9:46 am |
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Advanced Member |
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Joined: Jan 2006 Posts: 2296
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I remember reading a news post on the main page, I looked through them all the way to november '06 and couldn't find it again.
but then again Joymax has been known to delete or edit their news posts on a whim.
morningdew did specifically say that PK2 editing is against the rules and extremely unadvisable to do as it can get you a ban.
now the old guides i remember seeing around here all specifically said to edit at your own risk, and the funny thing about this is you had to edit it yourself
a little birdy was talking to me once about a certain place that had a preset pk2 edit for somethings, someone had got ahold of that clean edit and put in their keyloggers and began redistributing it.
the guides are all here to do it yourself, there is NO need to use someone elses premade pk2 edit.
let alone a damn program that does it for you
they call it common sense, except it's more uncommon then not, you all should try using it
_________________ <<banned from SRF for disrespect of the mod team and rules violations. -SG>>
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cin
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Post subject: Posted: Sat Jun 30, 2007 9:51 am |
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ok well i never saw that post by MD.
i can tell you that it looks as if i am the only one allowing these files on this
forum, but we have discussed this with the whole mod team and we
have all come to an agreement when it comes to pk2 edited files.
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Demarthl
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Post subject: Posted: Sat Jun 30, 2007 9:56 am |
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Advanced Member |
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Joined: Jan 2006 Posts: 2296
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alright so you won't mind me posting up a crack for softmod then.
same Farking difference.
_________________ <<banned from SRF for disrespect of the mod team and rules violations. -SG>>
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Vandango
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Post subject: Posted: Sat Jun 30, 2007 10:49 am |
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Banned User |
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Joined: Jun 2006 Posts: 4143 Location:
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Joymax Has Never Said OFFICALY That Editing The .pk2 Files Was against The EULA. MorningDew Said There was a new EULA which we so called "Already Agreed To" But Under Law We Must Re Agree To it. We Have Not Seen This New EULA Nor Have We had the chance to agree with it
Therefor Editing The .Pk2 Is Legal under There CURRENT EULA....
now with the Softmod issue It Edits The Anti Cheat System by removing it and im sure removing the anti cheat system is ILLEGAL
So Softmod= Illgeal
credits goto Masterwong
_________________ <<banned from SRF for bot admission. -SG>>
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Demarthl
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Post subject: Posted: Sat Jun 30, 2007 11:40 am |
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Advanced Member |
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Joined: Jan 2006 Posts: 2296
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<<edit: removed. -SG>>
_________________ <<banned from SRF for disrespect of the mod team and rules violations. -SG>>
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Key-J
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Post subject: Posted: Sat Jun 30, 2007 1:33 pm |
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Retired Admin |
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Joined: Jun 2006 Posts: 8238 Location: twitch.tv/AFKidsGaming
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Just a pre note, most of you think of me as a good mod, but also a great friend. Giving Authority and the term “one of the guys” new meaning, for this I thank you. However, for posting this, I might face repercussions by the Mod team but it does not bother me, it is needed.
SRO, there is no argument that it is no longer a uniform game. All these edits to change the game, or to change the look of the game. Now, this is where we need to draw the line.
In a Nutshell:
Pk2 editing is editing game files in order to change the appearance of your client, which is seen on your screen, affecting your character, on your computer. This does not affect how someone else views you.
Game editing is when you edit files that not only affect your game and your character, but it affects the other people’s game, when they view you. Botting, this is a game edit that makes you character move by itself, however this is not only on your screen. Everyone else will see your character moving by itself, thus botting.
How do we Pk2 edit? Well, most people like to use a Hex Editor, but not all of us are as godly at it like Cruor. I mean, ill be perfectly honest, I don’t Pk2 edit cuz I don’t want to, I don’t Pk2 edit because I don’t want to and I'm afraid I'm going to seriously mess up my game. Change the wrong 1 to a 0 and bye bye SRO.
I'm sure that I'm not the only person around that has a similar problem, however maybe they do want to Pk2 edit but don’t know how to and are too afraid to do it. What do these people do? Are they destined to live an Un-edited SRO life forever? No, they aren’t.
Just like other games, people have created programs that do the editing for you, to be very generalized think of them as computer macros. They go to your Pk2 files and edit the necessary code in order to get the result of a Pimped out 9D sword for example, this is why you see some people posting up Pk2 programs and say that you will get This, This and That. Yes, they are not just Pk2 edits; they are programs which edit your Pk2 files for you. And this was proved by cin, who btw, incase you’ve forgotten (since your acting like you did) is a Respected Member Of The SilkroadForums Moderation Team.
The other day, we were presented with a person who posted an edit that makes your Stall name scroll, however this did not only affect your client but the peoples around it, and this we did NOT allow. It was removed.
We the Mod team are completely in agreement with cin and his actions, as of this moment, in reflection to JM and what they have done, SRF has not deemed it illegal to post Pk2 edits. I mean, the first client side edit that I ever heard of was Black_Mamba when she turned her wolf; was it Camouflage blue if I'm not mistaken. Who knows, maybe she might have started the whole Pk2 craze.
Now Night Bloom, this part is a little more personal, you are one of the first members of the forums, there is no doubting that. You have a strong influence and hold on the forums. You have many allies here, including SG and Ryoko. A lot of the time, when people think of you they immediately, by acknowledgment think of SRF. However, the influence of your respect on my actions falls into the same category as the fly I squashed the other day. It means nothing. You may think of yourself as Royalty, you may think of yourself as being above the rules however, you would be greatly mistaken
You are a hot headed person, who rarely thinks about what you’re posting before you go and flame another member of the forums, and this time I find you having the sheer audacity to question, insult and speak to one of my fellow mods in that tone of voice? And in two separate posts! This does not flow well with me no matter how you look at it. Cin has every right to guess that it is a Pk2 edit before checking it, and was right to say download at your own risk.
However, you do not stop here you continue to argue and protest, and then you try to question SG’s rules. Do be aware that this is not the first time that I or another mod has brought you attitude and posts up for discussion, amongst the mods. Now, it might be true that you’ve had this tone before me nor any of the other mods were even members of the forums, but this does in no way give you any right at all to think that you can “push around” the mods, especially the new mods. No matter the join date, they have more authority and importance than you do. Period.
It is true that there are many people that frown upon Pk2 editing, and I do believe I have also seen MD say that they do not like it. However, I am still to see an official JM post saying that Pk2 is considered a banable and completely illegal offence. Now, for someone who seems so against editing your client, shall we discuss your little “edits”?
Demarthl, do not think that you are any less responsible. You are also a person who is hot headed and quick to flame. You your self also think that you are above the rules because you were a mod, however you are not anymore. The rules apply to you just the same as they apply to Night Bloom or any other user. You have had your name brought up in many discussions before, and unfortunately I have a feeling this will not be the last time unless something is done.
You have had inappropriate signatures which I had to PM you to remove, multiple times. And after you did remove it, you also had the audacity to post up a signature with a sarcastic line aimed at me and trying to secretively comment on my actions. You have been caught many times insulting members and getting into if not starting flame wars.
However, you yourself know that this is not the worst of you actions. You have done things in the past which are not at all accepted, you yourself know what it was and it was only because of your alliances on this forums that you remained. However, now with breaking one of the 5 Banable offences by openly and strongly insulting the Mod team and making it seem like our actions are unjust and undermined, it will take much more than your alliances to keep you here. To me, you are already gone.
Go play pirate somewhere else.
You can go to SG or Ryoko, but as a Mod team we stand united.
Now, I want to make it clear, this is an example to everyone else, it does not matter who you are, how long you have been here, if you’re a major part of SRF or not. The rules are the rules, and they will be upheld. I do not fear your reputation, you do something ban worthy you will be banned, mark my words. I know that I am not the only one that feels this way, fellow Mod members also feel this way and express that they will also follow through.
~Key-J
SRF Mod
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mushrooms
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Post subject: Posted: Sat Jun 30, 2007 2:09 pm |
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Active Member |
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Joined: Dec 2006 Posts: 675 Location:
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Quote: nightbloom wrote: It is not a PK2 edit, it is a program that supposedly unpatches the nude patch.
Quote: 2-Open the patch with the programe
If it were just a PK2 edit, why not just post a link for the PK2 file and replace yours with his?
Yeah, because its not just a PK2 edit. duh.
This program modifies the PK2 file for you. The reason why there is a 'patch' is because the PK2 file is too friggin' huge to upload.
On the official forum, Morningdew has said that PK2 editing is illegal in regards to Silkroad after someone asked about PK2 editing to re-enable the wind effect. So just a warning to you all. Don't try to edit your PK2 files cos you definitely do not want to feel the wrath of Morningdew's banhammer. (OK, she doesn't actually do the banning, I know...  ).
_________________ /\_/\ ( o.Ç ) (> ^)
 KSSR
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fena
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Post subject: Posted: Sat Jun 30, 2007 2:21 pm |
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Ex-Staff |
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Joined: May 2007 Posts: 4441 Location: Life
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Wow. When Key-J puts his foot down, he puts his foot down. Yay, Key-J!
& NB, I know that I'm just a little noob here at SRF, and given your reputation, both here, and ingame, I have no idea who I am to say this, but don't mess with Cin, okay?
 Cin. Great Mod. And even though he might be wrong at times, he tries his best, and I think that you should appreciate that. 
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Alfred
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Post subject: Posted: Sat Jun 30, 2007 2:45 pm |
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Loyal Member |
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Joined: Mar 2006 Posts: 1545 Location: .se
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In all honesty I would prefer this board to be free from any kind of files or programs that affects anything inside the silkroad folder. One day a keylogger might slip by unnoticed and the only nude patch you'll end up with is a stripped account.
But rules are rules.
Make sure you always do the virus scan yourself and think it over one extra time if you really want to put the safety of your acount in second hand.
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Crumpets
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Post subject: Posted: Sat Jun 30, 2007 2:49 pm |
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Forum Legend |
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Joined: Aug 2006 Posts: 7800 Location:
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JOYMAX CANT DETECT IF YOU HAVE CHANGED YOUR PK2 OR NOT.
_________________ << banned for being a constant problem. -cin >>
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Grimjaw
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Post subject: Posted: Sat Jun 30, 2007 3:01 pm |
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Elite Member |
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Joined: Nov 2006 Posts: 5136 Location: Final Fantasy Versus 13.
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fena wrote: Wow. When Key-J puts his foot down, he puts his foot down. Yay, Key-J!  & NB, I know that I'm just a little noob here at SRF, and given your reputation, both here, and ingame, I have no idea who I am to say this, but don't mess with Cin, okay?  Cin. Great Mod. And even though he might be wrong at times, he tries his best, and I think that you should appreciate that. 
Just because you like Cin and Cin happens to be a moderator,does not give you the freedom to play ''Clean up and kick afterwards mod''
Especially when it does not concern you.
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PK2 editing is bad mmmkay,and it should be forbidden on this forum.
Don't push you're luck with things like this or you're getting the heel of fate quite hard in a place of severe discomfort.
But then again if you feel like you are indeed the magical hero of justice and good fortune, edit at you're own leisure.
But don't open a topic 3 weeks later stating how you're account got blasted to hades,because i will Laugh my Ass off if it does happen.
Be smart,don't be a retard. 
_________________ Bmw 6 Series owner. Bleach fan. Music Fan.
Reise for Mod. ~ Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable..
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SuicideGrl
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Post subject: Posted: Sat Jun 30, 2007 3:05 pm |
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Retired Admin |
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Joined: Jan 2006 Posts: 8004 Location: World of Warcraft
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Grimjaw wrote: Just because you like Cin and Cin happens to be a moderator,does not give you the freedom to play ''Clean up and kick afterwards mod''
Especially when it does not concern you.
just because you don't feel that way doesn't give you the freedom to criticize others for showing support where they think it is needed.
especially when it doesn't concern you.
_________________
 Thx IceCrash for my awesome sig :) SRF Name Change Policy Having trouble accessing SRF?
dom wrote: RuYi wrote: Are you from outer space or something? He's from Jersey. Close enough.
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Grimjaw
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Post subject: Posted: Sat Jun 30, 2007 3:15 pm |
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Elite Member |
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Joined: Nov 2006 Posts: 5136 Location: Final Fantasy Versus 13.
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SuicideGrl wrote: Grimjaw wrote: Just because you like Cin and Cin happens to be a moderator,does not give you the freedom to play ''Clean up and kick afterwards mod''
Especially when it does not concern you. just because you don't feel that way doesn't give you the freedom to criticize others for showing support where they think it is needed. especially when it doesn't concern you.
I have no problem with members supporting other members,but i do know when it's supporting or trying to get a few kicks in.
_________________ Bmw 6 Series owner. Bleach fan. Music Fan.
Reise for Mod. ~ Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable..
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SuicideGrl
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Post subject: Posted: Sat Jun 30, 2007 3:19 pm |
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Retired Admin |
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Joined: Jan 2006 Posts: 8004 Location: World of Warcraft
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Grimjaw wrote: I have no problem with members supporting other members,but i do know when it's supporting or trying to get a few kicks in.
what difference does it make to you? you cannot possibly know the motivations behind fena's - or anyone's - actions. and even if it's true that he was trying to suck up, you still have no right to police his behavior.
_________________
 Thx IceCrash for my awesome sig :) SRF Name Change Policy Having trouble accessing SRF?
dom wrote: RuYi wrote: Are you from outer space or something? He's from Jersey. Close enough.
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Stefaab
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Post subject: Posted: Sat Jun 30, 2007 3:24 pm |
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Regular Member |
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Joined: Apr 2007 Posts: 265 Location: Belgium
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what a mess in this topic o_O
i think you guys should be a bit less theoretical and just use common sense, we all know the difference between pk2 edits and a thing like softmod or botters. pk2 is accepted in this community and bots aren't. personaly i couldn't care less if pk2 is allowed by JM or not because there is no way they can ever detect that you change the visual stuff of you client.
I think a lot of ppl are happy that someone gives them the chanse to download some kind of pk2 cause it could be damned hard to do it yourself.
I agree that it might happen that some kind of keylogger slips in over time, so i think everybody should be aware that we can never be 100% sure all files are safe. So imho the best sentence i read in this topic is 'Download at you own risk - Cin'.
~my 2cents
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borat2
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Post subject: Posted: Sat Jun 30, 2007 3:30 pm |
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Addicted Member |
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Joined: Jan 2007 Posts: 2547 Location: The Netherlands
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the biggest problem is deciding the line
What i was wondering are files that changes your own client .exe also allowed since it does not influence others (not bots but other 3rd party) since they only influence/change your own client and the effects of it are only for your own client.
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SuicideGrl
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Post subject: Posted: Sat Jun 30, 2007 3:30 pm |
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Retired Admin |
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Joined: Jan 2006 Posts: 8004 Location: World of Warcraft
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this discussion has gone on long enough. the mod team will be discussiong this topic at ghreat length over the next several days. until then, locked.
_________________
 Thx IceCrash for my awesome sig :) SRF Name Change Policy Having trouble accessing SRF?
dom wrote: RuYi wrote: Are you from outer space or something? He's from Jersey. Close enough.
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