Silkroad Online Forums

funny

i quess you have never played a hybrid.....didn't SG PROVED that int hybrid can be a very lethal build????? and if hybrid was weak, why people would be one?

take for example Liquidsmooth, he's str hybrid if i'm not wrong but he makes the biggest critical in his level.

and as a hybrid (for example int) you just have to take one weakness, becease your int is already high, only need to add int for extra damage, not the extra defence,


but this is only my opinion, i've readed yours too,

well uhm i shouldn't be saying this cause i'm still ashamed of it.. but my first char was a 1:1 cold/light hybrid archer and it s.ucked hard I figured that out at lvl 27 though.

But no basicly I never really played a hybrid my whole opinion and theory about a hybrid is purely based on my experience with fighting against hybrid. And then I started to think of a reason why they could all be so bad.

And like I said there are hybrids that do a great job. But it's a very hard and expensive build to make work. So you better be a pro if you start to make one, but sadly most ppl don't know what they are doing when they make hybrids. Maybe this is why i've got such a bad view about hybrids.

Then again most ppl don't know excactly what they are doing with pure int either.. and that's why ppl think that pure int s.ucks at pvp. And that's one of the reasons ppl go hybrid and end up with a build that can't be fixed. The thing is that when you stay pure your char can always be fixed. Skills can be de-lvl'd and gear can be switched but if you got some weird mag/phy balance then your char basicly is doomed.



okay you got a point here, cause pure int hardly needs any more dmg. But basicly what you are saying is.. you take some int points from your pure int build. And you put them in str making you a hybrid. Then you go and take more +int (to make up for the int points you put int str) for more dmg. Wouldn't It make more sense to take pure int and then add +str/+hp for more def/hp?? (that's what i'm doing)


as a conclusion. this is just my opion because I never met a strong hybrid. The first one (of my lvl) that pwnz me can completely change my mind

i agree with you for 50%, yes it's true that if you add str on your gear instead of adding str when you level up is about the same

but if you both have the same str on your gear, an int hybrid that have added something like 20 str has got more hp than a full int rightxD?
OH YEAH REMEMBER ONE THING, IM NOT SAYING THAT PURE INT SUCKS AND THAT HYBRID IS BETTER, im just saying they are both good builds:)

thanks for the discussion glavie , and now im gonna eat some cookies

yeah okay that's true.. but that was not my point.. I'm saying that you could get your extra hp by putting +str on your gear. And hybrids don't need more hp they need to do some dmg so getting more +str as a hybrid I don't get right now.

So i'm saying that a pure int with +20str his gear.
And a hybrid int with 20points into str and +20int on gear.
Are basicly the same hp/mp and phy/mag balance.

The Only diffrence is that the pure int can choose to go more +str or more int by chancing gear cause he already has the high dmg. But the hybrid uhm..well it's complicated with the hybrid. I had a theory but I wrote it down and it s.ucked. But the conclusion was that pure is more flexible then hybrids xD

okay go ahead takle this one down...it's a easy one.. i'm hungery and this was taking too long



okay great.. not saying hybrids suck either just that they are hard and expensive to build. And just like pure int many ppl fail in using it right. But the thing with a pure int is that you can set that right.. with a hybrid it's much harder... (hmm i have the feeling I said this before... deja-vu moment lol)

great topic.. ^^

i agree, they are basicly the same with such gear

well, as pure int you could also add a lot of int to do more damage rightxD? int hybrid just switched hp for power,


i wont try to say that int hybrid is dealing more damage, becease it's not true (with equal gear)





yes i agree, if you set your str:int with a hybrid wrong, you can't restore it like a pure int(just a matter of changing armour) for a hybrid imo you need to be an experienced player..
pure int and int hybrid with like 20 str can cost the same amount of money....full int will take 20 str and int hybrid takes 20 intxD


i think that was what i knew about pure int and int hybrid, just switching power for hpxD

edit: damn i had a hard time getting the quotes right

Whatcha talkin' about? You make it sound as if hybrids aren't able to raise their skills to 300 pts, only pures. The only difference between a pure and a hybrid is about 2-5% extra dmg from their physical/magical ratios, which they easily make up by doing more physical dmg with the weaker magical, but also gain a lot more hp. Their skills are still the same. Right now I have around a 74% physical ratio, and a 106% magical ratio, and almost all my skills are up to my lvl (except for the 6 gap). Where did everything just magically disappear and leave me restricted into what skills I can learn?



I actually deal more damage than pures, especially when uphunting (thanks to the extra hp, and s/s, not dying from one crit). Most nukers use two nukes in a row, and that's a slow charge up time. The only times they don't use two nukes in a row is when underhunting or hunting at their lvl, which a hybrid can one-shot nuke the monsters too. Since nukers deal so much dmg, the extra dmg from that 2nd nuke winds up being wasted overkill. If they can't kill something one nuke and lion shout, that's when you get that problem. For a hybrid, something like a nuke then a devil cut, that deals more dmg than a pure int nuke and lion shock, even more so when they crit on that evil cut.

The combo of a nuke and evil cut is faster than casting two nukes, and mine will be dead first because of the faster casting rate compared to two nukes. Balancing out speed and dmg to be right on the dot is what allows a hybrid to deal more dmg faster than just doing slow over-powered nukes over and over for excessive dmg.

- N

no no.. not at all.. this was in responds to something someone said. My point is that the diffrence in builds becomes bigger at higher lvl. Because of the skills that do more dmg. And the pures that get higher mag/phy balance. A lvl 10 pure int and a lvl 10 pure str are still pretty much the same. At lvl 80 you can not say that at all.



well no this is not entirely true. Mag dmg is higher then phys dmg. So if you take some points out of int and put them in str then you will do more phy dmg then a pure int. And the % in phy dmg increase is prob the same as the decrease in mag dmg. But 1% mag dmg is higher then 1%phy dmg. So you will do less dmg.


I'm not saying this at all... ofcourse you can get all the skills any othher build can get too.




Well yes true.. uhm dunno about a s/s nuker cause I only use my spear to grind. But I have 2 combo's fire nuke + lion shout, light nuke +ghostspear. This kills all the mobs. If the first combo can't and I need more dmg then I use firenuke+ghostspear and lightnuke +stun those combo's both do more dmg. I'm well aware of the overkill principle and nukers are all about killing as fast as possible so this is how I try to achieve that.



This is again partially true..... yes when you hit a crit you'll maybe do more dmg on a devil cut then a lion shout. But only then.. devil cut does less dmg then the lion shout. Again because mag dmg is higher then phy dmg. And the lion shout is faster too.



Well already adressed this point.. You have to look as a nuker that you don't overkill but just like a hybrid, a pure int can use some weapon skills too. So there are other skills faster then a nuke for if the mob has little hp left. The only time I use 2 nukes in a row is on a champion or giant. I always look at the mobs hp after I shot my first nuke and then guess what skill I will need to finish it off.

Cause on devil yeti it really depends on how high my nukes hit. Some how the diffrence on them is bigger. So sometimes 2nukes +lionshout won't kill them. So after the second nuke I check their hp and decide if I go with lionshout or with ghostspear wich is a little slower but does more dmg.

Evil and devil cut do more dmg than lion shocks even without a crit. That 150% you see after the number gains a huge bonus combined with magic attack, even though on the skill page you may see an evil or devil cut with a dmg range of half a lion shout. Something that does say 100-150 dmg with a 150% bonus will do more than a 250-300 but only 100% bonus.

- N

last book of lion shout lvl 1 does 272-504(3 simultanious attacks)
last book of blade force lvl 1 does 226 -276 (2 succesive shots)
so last books wins for sure.


now as for the second book who has the 150% bonus you talk about. It's not a bonus it's a dmg %. So here's how it would look like.

second book of blade force lv1 1 does 97-118(150%) => 145.5 - 177=> 161.25
second book of lionshout lvl 1 does 126-233(100%) => 179.5

And that is not counting that the second book of devil cut blade only hits 1 mob and the lionshout hits 3. So if you add the 3 dmg's together it's even more.

And what is also not added is the imbue wich also gives a pure int more dmg then it does a hybrid.

So when you look at all this.. you can savely say that if you would have a pure str do 100 blade cuts and a pure int 100 lion shouts both at the same lvl, same gear etc etc.. so purely looking at the dmg based upon the skill then the lion shout would deal more dmg.

I'm not talking about comparing a pure str char vs a pure int char to show that the blade cuts do more dmg than lion shout. I'm talking about having character themselves do each of the attacks regardless of build, and the evil cuts will do more dmg. Use even yourself if you're a pure int and see what deals more dmg, lion shout or the evil cuts -- the evil cut outta do at least 400-900 more dmg, not even counting any crits.

- N

well i got my first book upped to the max so i can't just take lvl 1 of the first book of devil cut. And i'm sure as hell are not gonna up it till 9 just to prove you wrong.

But listen to what you are saying. what i took in my example is

pure str with devil cut.. cause that build will do the most dmg with
devil cut.. correct????

and pure int with lion shout.. cause that build will do the most dmg with a lion shout..... also correct right???

Now you think that a pure int will do more dmg with just a devil cut.. then a pure str..?? that is what you are saying or did i get you wrong..??

It's a phys based attack.. how can it ever do more dmg for a pure int then a mag based attack. When even the number say that it does less dmg. I really don't get what you are saying.


I took pure str in this example to give the devil cut a advantage.. the same as lion shout has. To show you that even with max dmg and best build for it..(pure str) it almost never outdamages a lion shout. So that you would understand that if your phy dmg is lower. That the devil cut can sure as hell not outdmg the lionshout with a a build that has even less phy balance and there for whil do less phy dmg. So really unless you see something wrong in the fact and arguments in my previous post. I still think i'm right.

And sorry but i'm not gonna waste sp on something that i'm like 99% sure of that i'm right.. I could always be wrong but you have really not said anything to convince me otherwise... come with some fact..numbers.. someone who tried or tested it.. whatever.. but don't just say go try it..

I have a char i can use to find out. I have also heard that devil cut does more than a shout of equal level. The benefit of a shout though, is that it does the same damage to 3 mobs, the damage dosnt degrade like most other AOE attacks do, whereas the devil cut only hits 1 (unless you have the last book)

But yea..i will try to get to that tonight

So i thought i would post after my post instead of editing so it would bump this topic so you could see my results.

So yea, i checked it out yesterday. I dont have screenies atm, had to get to bed pretty quick, but i will get them up when i get home again tonight.

I used the second book of shout at lvl 7 i think it was (needed lvl 51 mastery to lvl up) and i had blade cut maxed with a lvl 45 bicheon mastery. So the lion shout is a higher level then the blade cut.

The character is lvl 64 and i was testing on Power Earth Ghosts with a +5 sword, 115% mag balance (pure int), and the 3rd book of fire imbue.

The lion shout did a pretty steady 2k damage while the blade cut did a steady 2600. They both fluctuated about 200 points either way, but the lion shout was always short by a few hundred points.

Does this mean that the blade cut is better? Well, i would say no simply because of the splash. If 3 mobs are hitting me and i do a shout, it hits all 3 for roughly the same damage, which really helps as a nuker, cause it wears down multiple mobs preparing for an AOE nuke to finish them off. Whereas the cut only hits 1 mob.