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NuclearSilo
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Post subject: Upgrading image code verification system Posted: Tue Jan 23, 2007 3:37 pm |
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Joined: Aug 2006 Posts: 8834 Location: Age of Wushu
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As u all can see, with this new update, we can only prevent bots which have autologin to login. But what if they login manually then start to botting? They will never log off, unless they have bad graphic card that keep them disconnect from the server.
So i suggest a new method of image code verification :
JM can implement a security code inside the game. A message will pop-up when the character is in state of combat and require the player to enter the correct code (with 3 characters long is enough)(note that running, stalling, talking... are not considered as combat state but only when u touch a monster). The popup message appears each 50~80 mins. Before the message popup 2 mins, there will be a warning alert. Player has 5 mins to enter ; after that or 5 times fails, the player will be disconnected from the server.
As u can see, this is a good way to disconnect a bot. Once it is disconnected, it cant relogin again due to the security when logging in. If u want a better game, why not sacrifice just 10s to fill the code? 
_________________ Playing Age of Wushu, dota IMBA
Last edited by NuclearSilo on Tue Jan 23, 2007 3:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Luoma
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Post subject: Posted: Tue Jan 23, 2007 3:46 pm |
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Joined: Sep 2006 Posts: 3895 Location: Artists Corner & Aege
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i think its a great idea!... as long as its just a little message in the corner of the screen 
_________________ <<banned from SRF for proof of botting. -SG>>
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Project-Dragon
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Post subject: Posted: Tue Jan 23, 2007 3:50 pm |
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Joined: Oct 2006 Posts: 328 Location: Germany
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wont stop babysitting but good solution against afk botting
but what will joymax do?
_________________ My German Blog about Gaming (including Silkroad)
 http://www.projectgaming.de
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Deacon
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Post subject: Posted: Tue Jan 23, 2007 3:52 pm |
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Joined: May 2006 Posts: 4377 Location: De Dutch
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That is also in Hero online, GREAT ACTION 
_________________ I cannot sing the blues...
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Waisha
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Post subject: Posted: Tue Jan 23, 2007 3:54 pm |
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Joined: Apr 2006 Posts: 3216 Location: wat
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Im a newb at computers but is there a way for JM to detect if they log on with a bot or not.
_________________ <<banned from SRF for rules violations. -SG>>
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Flakangaroo
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Post subject: Posted: Tue Jan 23, 2007 3:56 pm |
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Joined: Feb 2006 Posts: 50 Location:
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Bad idea because if you noticed in silkroad if a screen pops up such as a trade screen it stops everything. The person would die and many people would get p/o'ed and quit the game. I strongly suggest 'NO' to this idea.
_________________ Server - Xian
Level - 75, 54, 26
Server - Tibet
Level - 26
Server - Greece
Level - 22
Server - Pacific
Level - 1
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BlackFox
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Post subject: Posted: Tue Jan 23, 2007 4:01 pm |
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Joined: Jan 2007 Posts: 6588 Location: Oo Some where i dont know!!
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Is stupid Idea , I agree whit Flakangaroo
_________________ mwahahahahaha !!
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NuclearSilo
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Post subject: Posted: Tue Jan 23, 2007 4:03 pm |
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| Forum God |
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Joined: Aug 2006 Posts: 8834 Location: Age of Wushu
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Flakangaroo wrote: Bad idea because if you noticed in silkroad if a screen pops up such as a trade screen it stops everything. The person would die and many people would get p/o'ed and quit the game. I strongly suggest 'NO' to this idea. As i mentioned above, there will be an alert that warn u when the popup will appear, so u have about 2 mins to stop your combat action and go to a safe place ; u cant die in 10s just for filling the code. Quote: wont stop babysitting but good solution against afk botting
but what will joymax do?
GMs are watching the forum. If the majority of players are agreed with this idea (botter's vote wont count  ), they will sure do something like that to prevent bots.
_________________ Playing Age of Wushu, dota IMBA
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Luoma
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Post subject: Posted: Tue Jan 23, 2007 4:07 pm |
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Joined: Sep 2006 Posts: 3895 Location: Artists Corner & Aege
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Flakangaroo wrote: Bad idea because if you noticed in silkroad if a screen pops up such as a trade screen it stops everything. The person would die and many people would get p/o'ed and quit the game. I strongly suggest 'NO' to this idea.
well i think they could do something to stop it stopping everything?
+ yea as Nuclearsilo said, there could be like a 2 or even 10min alert before it will come up.
_________________ <<banned from SRF for proof of botting. -SG>>
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Megalomaniac
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Post subject: Posted: Tue Jan 23, 2007 4:13 pm |
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Joined: Jul 2006 Posts: 3132
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Annoying to log in -.- But if it keeps bots from re-logging then i guess its a good thing after all.
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durant
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Post subject: Re: Upgrading image code verification system Posted: Tue Jan 23, 2007 5:35 pm |
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Joined: Oct 2006 Posts: 70 Location:
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NuclearSilo wrote: As u all can see, with this new update, we can only prevent bots which have autologin to login. But what if they login manually then start to botting? They will never log off, unless they have bad graphic card that keep them disconnect from the server. So i suggest a new method of image code verification : JM can implement a security code inside the game. A message will pop-up when the character is in state of combat and require the player to enter the correct code (with 3 characters long is enough)(note that running, stalling, talking... are not considered as combat state but only when u touch a monster). The popup message appears each 50~80 mins. Before the message popup 2 mins, there will be a warning alert. Player has 5 mins to enter ; after that or 5 times fails, the player will be disconnected from the server. As u can see, this is a good way to disconnect a bot. Once it is disconnected, it cant relogin again due to the security when logging in. If u want a better game, why not sacrifice just 10s to fill the code? 
Such a bad idea. It would be extremely inconvenient for players and Joymax, I'd imagine.
What they need to do is update protectors (the things that "prevent" auto attacking). If they take on the name and info of the monster you summon it on, then bot programs can't tell the difference. They should also make it so that, when you die from attacking a protector, you loose more experience and are disconnected. It'll impede botters a good deal.
_________________ Level 6x Int-Hybrid Sword
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Luoma
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Post subject: Re: Upgrading image code verification system Posted: Tue Jan 23, 2007 5:41 pm |
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Joined: Sep 2006 Posts: 3895 Location: Artists Corner & Aege
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durant wrote: Such a bad idea. It would be extremely inconvenient for players and Joymax, I'd imagine.
What they need to do is update protectors (the things that "prevent" auto attacking). If they take on the name and info of the monster you summon it on, then bot programs can't tell the difference. They should also make it so that, when you die from attacking a protector, you loose more experience and are disconnected. It'll impede botters a good deal.
im pretty sure they can. people who bot usally use a thing called "Pink Mob", that is when they edit the packet files so that all the monsters go pink. then the bot program searches for pixels that are pink. the protectors isnt pink, the bot wont attack it. if it has name or not.
_________________ <<banned from SRF for proof of botting. -SG>>
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AngerFist_
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Post subject: Posted: Tue Jan 23, 2007 5:55 pm |
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Joined: Dec 2006 Posts: 49 Location:
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Only autoit bots use pink mobs and those bots suck. also GG blocks autoit scripts.
EDIT - oh i see GG is gone. But still autoit bots are slow and rarely hit the target, so they're still useless.
Last edited by AngerFist_ on Tue Jan 23, 2007 5:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Luoma
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Post subject: Posted: Tue Jan 23, 2007 5:56 pm |
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Joined: Sep 2006 Posts: 3895 Location: Artists Corner & Aege
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AngerFist_ wrote: Only autoit bots use pink mobs and those bots suck. also GG blocks autoit scripts.
well i still dont think taking away info about them will work >_<
_________________ <<banned from SRF for proof of botting. -SG>>
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NuclearSilo
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Post subject: Re: Upgrading image code verification system Posted: Tue Jan 23, 2007 5:59 pm |
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| Forum God |
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Joined: Aug 2006 Posts: 8834 Location: Age of Wushu
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durant wrote: NuclearSilo wrote: As u all can see, with this new update, we can only prevent bots which have autologin to login. But what if they login manually then start to botting? They will never log off, unless they have bad graphic card that keep them disconnect from the server. So i suggest a new method of image code verification : JM can implement a security code inside the game. A message will pop-up when the character is in state of combat and require the player to enter the correct code (with 3 characters long is enough)(note that running, stalling, talking... are not considered as combat state but only when u touch a monster). The popup message appears each 50~80 mins. Before the message popup 2 mins, there will be a warning alert. Player has 5 mins to enter ; after that or 5 times fails, the player will be disconnected from the server. As u can see, this is a good way to disconnect a bot. Once it is disconnected, it cant relogin again due to the security when logging in. If u want a better game, why not sacrifice just 10s to fill the code?  Such a bad idea. It would be extremely inconvenient for players and Joymax, I'd imagine. What they need to do is update protectors (the things that "prevent" auto attacking). If they take on the name and info of the monster you summon it on, then bot programs can't tell the difference. They should also make it so that, when you die from attacking a protector, you loose more experience and are disconnected. It'll impede botters a good deal.
So it means that if i spawn a protector next to u, because it has the same name and shape like other mob so u cant tell the difference, u'll hit it and die and lose exp. Is that what u want? 
_________________ Playing Age of Wushu, dota IMBA
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Grimjaw
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Post subject: Posted: Tue Jan 23, 2007 6:32 pm |
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| Elite Member |
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Joined: Nov 2006 Posts: 5136 Location: Final Fantasy Versus 13.
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Megalomaniac wrote: Annoying to log in -.- But if it keeps bots from re-logging then i guess its a good thing after all.
_________________ Bmw 6 Series owner. Bleach fan. Music Fan.
Reise for Mod. ~ Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable..
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durant
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Post subject: Re: Upgrading image code verification system Posted: Tue Jan 23, 2007 11:12 pm |
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| Casual Member |
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Joined: Oct 2006 Posts: 70 Location:
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NuclearSilo wrote: durant wrote: NuclearSilo wrote: As u all can see, with this new update, we can only prevent bots which have autologin to login. But what if they login manually then start to botting? They will never log off, unless they have bad graphic card that keep them disconnect from the server. So i suggest a new method of image code verification : JM can implement a security code inside the game. A message will pop-up when the character is in state of combat and require the player to enter the correct code (with 3 characters long is enough)(note that running, stalling, talking... are not considered as combat state but only when u touch a monster). The popup message appears each 50~80 mins. Before the message popup 2 mins, there will be a warning alert. Player has 5 mins to enter ; after that or 5 times fails, the player will be disconnected from the server. As u can see, this is a good way to disconnect a bot. Once it is disconnected, it cant relogin again due to the security when logging in. If u want a better game, why not sacrifice just 10s to fill the code?  Such a bad idea. It would be extremely inconvenient for players and Joymax, I'd imagine. What they need to do is update protectors (the things that "prevent" auto attacking). If they take on the name and info of the monster you summon it on, then bot programs can't tell the difference. They should also make it so that, when you die from attacking a protector, you loose more experience and are disconnected. It'll impede botters a good deal. So it means that if i spawn a protector next to u, because it has the same name and shape like other mob so u cant tell the difference, u'll hit it and die and lose exp. Is that what u want? 
I apologize for not being so clear. It would take on the name, level, or whatever information bot programs use to attack certain mobs. It would still have the shape of a protector.
_________________ Level 6x Int-Hybrid Sword
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Doppleganger
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Post subject: Posted: Tue Jan 23, 2007 11:32 pm |
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Joined: Jan 2007 Posts: 2706 Location: Resistance Headquarters
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IguanaRampage
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Post subject: Posted: Wed Jan 24, 2007 12:42 am |
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Joined: Jul 2006 Posts: 2483 Location: Changing
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I was thinking of that myself. And if the popup came in the safezone, afk stallers would lose out more than botters. However, I also think that all mobs should freeze for this time being, and it cannot occur if you are close to a unique.
_________________ McCain, he (Barack Obama) said, will soon "be accusing me of being a secret communist because I shared my toys in kindergarten."
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Da_Realest
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Post subject: Posted: Wed Jan 24, 2007 1:11 am |
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Joined: Apr 2006 Posts: 2435 Location:
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They just implemented the verification code. Don't expect major changes or Joymax to consider suggestions anytime soon to the system. Its nice to make suggestions but be content with the current situation we are in for now.
Your idea would become to much of a hassle. Nothing is fool proof. It may take a while but bot makers would manage to overcome it one way or another and it would only put much more strain on the legit players playing.
_________________
Ziegfried wrote: What you do or say in any game is a small extension of who you really are. It's the anonymity that can allow them to show their true self, or who they would be if there was no "penalty" for their actions.
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IguanaRampage
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Post subject: Posted: Wed Jan 24, 2007 1:14 am |
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Joined: Jul 2006 Posts: 2483 Location: Changing
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Da_Realest wrote: They just implemented the verification code. Don't expect major changes or Joymax to consider suggestions anytime soon to the system. Its nice to make suggestions but be content with the current situation we are in for now.
Your idea would become to much of a hassle. Nothing is fool proof. It may take a while but bot makers would manage to overcome it one way or another and it would only put much more strain on the legit players playing.
bot players aren't that brilliant. If Yahoo! and other companies use image verification to minimize spam from their e-mail accounts, I think it is a good solution.
_________________ McCain, he (Barack Obama) said, will soon "be accusing me of being a secret communist because I shared my toys in kindergarten."
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Frozen
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Post subject: Posted: Wed Jan 24, 2007 1:20 am |
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Joined: Sep 2006 Posts: 347
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Finally a great idea that's been implemented, Grats to Joymax.
_________________ <<banned from SRF for bot support. -SG>>
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Voidream
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Post subject: Posted: Wed Jan 24, 2007 1:21 am |
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Joined: Jun 2006 Posts: 201 Location:
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Alternatively they could have something similar to the fatigue system runescape introduced. In runescape, with each action you did, e.g. fighting a mob, mining, smithing, crafting etc, your fatigue level goes up a bit. And each time you want to reset your fatigue level you have to do image
verification.
Joymax could implement a similar system where you have to do image verification every every 200 mobs or so. Not doing the 'fatigue' reset makes you unable to attack any more mobs. As has been suggested, I think a short 3 alphanumeric image should be enough.
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Da_Realest
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Post subject: Posted: Wed Jan 24, 2007 1:27 am |
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Joined: Apr 2006 Posts: 2435 Location:
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IguanaRampage wrote: Da_Realest wrote: They just implemented the verification code. Don't expect major changes or Joymax to consider suggestions anytime soon to the system. Its nice to make suggestions but be content with the current situation we are in for now.
Your idea would become to much of a hassle. Nothing is fool proof. It may take a while but bot makers would manage to overcome it one way or another and it would only put much more strain on the legit players playing. bot players aren't that brilliant. If Yahoo! and other companies use image verification to minimize spam from their e-mail accounts, I think it is a good solution. Never underestimate the enemy. I'm pretty sure thats what Joymax did and why the game is in the state its in now. You must also realized that not all image verification processes are the same.
Anyway, technology is constantly changing allowing some things to become easier to accomplish than before.
_________________
Ziegfried wrote: What you do or say in any game is a small extension of who you really are. It's the anonymity that can allow them to show their true self, or who they would be if there was no "penalty" for their actions.
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Naoto
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Post subject: Posted: Wed Jan 24, 2007 9:16 am |
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Joined: Jan 2007 Posts: 89 Location: South Africa
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It wouldnt be too much of a hastle.
It gives you 5 mins warning, it pitches up say really small, and next to your health, or somewhere not in the way, it lets you have 5 mins leway... i.e finish off your mob or whatever your doing and in the meantime then after type in, it takes 5-6secs to type in 3 characters.
Those who don't, get one second attempt (For those that happen to go afk for some reason or another for 10mins) before getting kicked and banned for 24hours (or whatever punishment is deemed). There has to be a second attempt for those who are legit. I'm not sure how it could be implemented, but its an idea.
Not a big thing, plenty of time and warning.
No need to pause game or anything.
I cast my vote, it's a great idea!
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borat2
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Post subject: Posted: Wed Jan 24, 2007 10:42 am |
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Joined: Jan 2007 Posts: 2547 Location: The Netherlands
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this sure is a great idea but you cant stop gold farming bots like this you just make the problem even bigger, just cause they will get disconnected each 50-80minutes just will make them create even more gold farming bots to be sure they still get enough gold, i am even more surprised that for example on redsea the gold farming bots have moved to less active (less common) places to grind, this is one thing i am really happy about this of course prevent players from getting annoyed/ks by bots.
The only way you can stop gold bots is by doing something about the economy and ban gold buyers anything else will just make the problem probably even bigger.
Joymax bans the gold farmers - they create new ones
Image code - creates more bots just to be sure that when you have to log in it is worth the time.
Making bots disconnect - even more bots to get the gold in the same time.
STOP BUYING GOLD AND STOP OVERPRICING ITEMS (our western culture just messes up this game that is all) then the problem will be solved.
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XMoshe
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Post subject: Posted: Wed Jan 24, 2007 12:05 pm |
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Joined: Apr 2006 Posts: 17293 Location: Ghosting around
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I really like the idea. It isnt to hard to enter a code every hour =)
_________________
Props to chrisorg for the sig <3
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Damir
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Post subject: Posted: Wed Jan 24, 2007 3:10 pm |
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monet
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Post subject: Posted: Wed Jan 24, 2007 3:54 pm |
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Joined: Jan 2007 Posts: 238 Location:
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i think idea is good, but the image should be simple. i dont like this black whit e ones cos once i made the correct guess in 3/3. like i know what is 0 or O or B or 8 with all that shit over it.
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