What has pwr lvl'ing got to do with not being 'legit'

borat2 · **Posted:** Fri Oct 12, 2007 2:27 am

weird point.
Should i suddenly feel bad because i can afford a premium ticket and my buddy cant connect? NO it might sound hard but that is a big NO, if you cant make friends who are willing to grind with you then you are in the wrong game.

there are things that cant be changed.
why is powerlevel unfair? to who? to me because i sp farmed 2 months and getting same results, while some random player gets power level now and get that same sp in 1 or 2 weeks? i don`t consider that unfair i consider that as an evolution in the game.

If you think its unfair simply restart, find someone who want to power level you and farm that sp or get power level to high level.
Before item mall people had fun too.

think marikit said it all perfect, he/she got a friend who was willing to do it, IT supposed to be like this, the only wrong thing is everyone claiming to be legit while it (powerlevel) was done by a bot.

finally Joymax introduces a system that can get people closer to each other ( MAKING CONTACT with other players) and everyone bitches about how unfair it is, work on your in game social skills then you wont have anything to complain about.

give me a break.

AlterEgos · **Joined:** Jan 2007 **Posts:** 297 **Location:**

omg plus wan boart !

NAIISE

OG_DeX · **Joined:** Oct 2007 **Posts:** 109 **Location:**

Like i said , i didnt cry and whine when it took me months to get to 42 and euros had past me after only weeks. Whining about fairness in a game? Id hate to see what happens when some of these people go outside

I dont care what somebody with a funny name from an mmorpg thinks of me at all , but im not here to stir trouble either. So im sorry if i offended anybody and if i did.....

*****Edit

Was kinda mean so i took it out , i can see how some of you are by your posts and i dont want to hurt any feelings

XemnasXD · **Posted:** Fri Oct 12, 2007 3:05 am

@OG_DeX didn't a few pages back you state you were done with this forum after 2 post......so....yeah why are you still posting

Da_Realest · **Joined:** Apr 2006 **Posts:** 2435 **Location:**

OG_DeX wrote:

....

Why you left the guild and the union is irrelevant. That fact is, if you didn't leave you were going to be kicked because of being pwrlvled by a bot. I was fully aware of the situation so your pretentious thoughts about what you thought I didn't know are unnecessary.

Your poor grammar makes me question how do you feel you're in a position to correct my grammar usage.

School is just a traditional place where people learn. Outside the school and any form of long distance communication(MMORPG?) is where learning limitations are removed.

OG_DeX wrote:

Whining about fairness in a game? Id hate to see what happens when some of these people go outside

Its more than just a "game" to some. Life is just a "game" to some. Although, I thought that a key concept behind "games" involves fairness. It truly is a shame that you think that understanding is limited to "outside."

OG_DeX wrote:

I dont care what somebody with a funny name from an mmorpg thinks of me at all , but im not here to stir trouble either. So im sorry if i offended anybody and if i did.....

If you don't care about what someone thinks about you from a MMORPG then why did you bother replying on a MMORPG fan forum about it?

OG_DeX wrote:

Hakubi isnt accusing , i was pwrlvld by very high lvl , well known botters. Were they botting at the time? Who knows? Who cares? Not me. There was never any secret. As i said in the other post , its totally meaningless. My credit score is the same , my fridge is still full and my bills are paid.

Who knows? I know. The union knows. We had members in the area confirm that the person was botting while pwrlvling you.

So, flaunting about your credit score, refrigerator, and paid bills on a MMORPG fan forum makes you feel better about yourself?

arctic197 · **Posted:** Fri Oct 12, 2007 3:32 am

Wello27 wrote:

I love these LAZY MOFOS trying to defend their LAZY method of leveling.

Keep justifying your "legit botting"

ROFL

So pathetic, its sad.

As sad as it may seem, one side of this whole thread has been justifying their what you call "legit botting." Sadly enough, I can neither agree nor disagree with you here

OG_DeX · **Joined:** Oct 2007 **Posts:** 109 **Location:**

lol

Im not gonna bother qouting all that , there's a significant difference between being kicked and going to be kicked. If it makes you feel better some how to say 'he was gonna be kicked nayway' then fine. Fact is that its a game and games are supposed to be fun. PE union wasnt fun so WE quit. Not just me.

My thoughts werent pretentious , i was mistaken. See since what you said wasnt true i gave you the beneift and thought you didnt know , since you clearly did know , then you werent ignorant , your just a liar. A pathetic liar who needs to tell lies to make him/herself feel better

I can tell by your post your trying real hard to look smart , so look again at the part where i said i didnt care what anybody thought.... did you look?... Notice the big EDIT**** and what followed?

I wasnt flaunting anything , i was trying to show that there are important things in life.... and then there's sro. A point that you seem to have missed. Its funny , i have no idea who you are lol

Oh well. See ya

Da_Realest · **Joined:** Apr 2006 **Posts:** 2435 **Location:**

OG_DeX wrote:

lol

Im not gonna bother qouting all that , there's a significant difference between being kicked and going to be kicked. If it makes you feel better some how to say 'he was gonna be kicked nayway' then fine. Fact is that its a game and games are supposed to be fun. PE union wasnt fun so WE quit. Not just me.

My thoughts werent pretentious , i was mistaken. See since what you said wasnt true i gave you the beneift and thought you didnt know , since you clearly did know , then you werent ignorant , your just a liar. A pathetic liar who needs to tell lies to make him/herself feel better

I can tell by your post your trying real hard to look smart , so look again at the part where i said i didnt care what anybody thought.... did you look?... Notice the big EDIT**** and what followed?

I wasnt flaunting anything , i was trying to show that there are important things in life.... and then there's sro. A point that you seem to have missed. Its funny , i have no idea who you are lol

Oh well. See ya

As far as I'm concerned, since you were going to be kicked its pretty much the same as being kicked.

Actions speak louder than words. If you don't care, don't post.

Anyway, believe what you want.

OG_DeX · **Joined:** Oct 2007 **Posts:** 109 **Location:**

And you had members int he area to confirm?? lol Let me run it down for you....

1. Buki comes in union and announces new rule
2. I laugh at rule and head out the the mages to be pwrlvld
3. I whisper rukia_7 and tell her im out there and , in my exact words , "tell them so they can come see me and get pissed"
4. Rukia , Sunaj/Sisay (one of em) Cidem(my GM) and Buki all come out

Your members were in the area because i called them out there. You talk like you busted me doing something , i wanted it to be absolutely clear that i dont give a sh*t what anybody in PE thinks. And the next day 5 of us quit

So ask Rukia , buki or Cidem if it happend like i just said

OG_DeX · **Joined:** Oct 2007 **Posts:** 109 **Location:**

Da_Realest wrote:

As far as I'm concerned, since you were going to be kicked its pretty much the same as being kicked.

Anyway, believe what you want.

What i believe is irrelevant , the FACTS are what they are

OG_DeX · **Joined:** Oct 2007 **Posts:** 109 **Location:**

XemnasXD wrote:

@OG_DeX didn't a few pages back you state you were done with this forum after 2 post......so....yeah why are you still posting

Got sucked in lol :oops:

Thanks for reminding me , its dumb and this thread isnt about me

bye

Da_Realest · **Joined:** Apr 2006 **Posts:** 2435 **Location:**

OG_DeX wrote:

And you had members int he area to confirm?? lol Let me run it down for you....

1. Buki comes in union and announces new rule
2. I laugh at rule and head out the the mages to be pwrlvld
3. I whisper rukia_7 and tell her im out there and , in my exact words , "tell them so they can come see me and get pissed"
4. Rukia , Sunaj/Sisay (one of em) Cidem(my GM) and Buki all come out

Your members were in the area because i called them out there. You talk like you busted me doing something , i wanted it to be absolutely clear that i dont give a sh*t what anybody in PE thinks. And the next day 5 of us quit

So ask Rukia , buki or Cidem if it happend like i just said

No need. I was on at the time. Where is the part where a member lured pt mobs unto you guys and you got you guys killed why your pwrlvler kept going?

Whats important to you may not be as important to someone else. You shouldn't look down upon someone just because they spend large amounts of time playing a game, their issues of "fairness" in a game, etc.

If you want to continue, PM me. I think this has gotten too far off topic.

arctic197 · **Posted:** Fri Oct 12, 2007 4:43 am

Not again LOL

When you are being powerleveled by a non-botter - you got high level without doing anything
When you are being powerleveled by a botter - you got high level without doing anything

I see no difference in the results.

So why make up a new "rule" against powerlevelers when you know both situations end up getting to a high level?

dhevskie · **Joined:** Jul 2007 **Posts:** 155 **Location:**

roflcopter wrote:

I dont understand what being pwr lvl'd has got to do with not being legit. Ive seen this mentioned various times over the past few weeks. Yes perhaps if said person got pwr lvl'd by someone who was 'afk' then i can see where the problem arises, but still, the person not using the 3rd party programme is not actually breaking the rules.

The way the exp share system works and the exp penalty for the lvl gaps shows that its perfectly acceptable for someone to be pwr lvl'd. I honestly dont understand what its got to do with not being legit, maybe im wrong and id like people to make their point without de-railing the entire thread and rinsing out the same old discussion.

I just want to discuss the issue of being pwr lvl'd. The game mechanism allows it, so whats the big deal?

i have no idea, but to me being legit means 100% personal manual grind and anything otherwise is not legit, thats my own opinion, anyone being powerleveled is lazy he dont grind himself, these kind of people are prone to botting, why simply coz they dont have the will do it themselves, too lazy, so if no one will powerlevel em they probably be tempted to bot, lolz, lazy

the_wicked · **Posted:** Fri Oct 12, 2007 5:17 am

can someone just lock the thread or something =_=

Aiyas · **Posted:** Fri Oct 12, 2007 5:23 am

the_wicked wrote:

can someone just lock the thread or something =_=

Agreed.

All of the reasonable arguments for or against it have been exhausted, as far as I can see.

arctic197 · **Posted:** Fri Oct 12, 2007 5:47 am

Aiyas wrote:

the_wicked wrote:

can someone just lock the thread or something =_=

Agreed.

All of the reasonable arguments for or against it have been exhausted, as far as I can see.

Fail. And fail. *sigh*

You know what, let me try that.

Lock this: http://www.silkroadforums.com/viewtopic.php?t=63275
And this one too: http://www.silkroadforums.com/viewtopic.php?t=63137
Oh, and this one too: http://www.silkroadforums.com/viewtopic.php?t=63052

Wow, I just turned into one of you guys. Who knew huh.

TOloseGT · **Joined:** Sep 2006 **Posts:** 7129 **Location:**

wow, what else is there to talk about? plvling is obviously legit cuz joymax has never banned a single person for being plvled.

Cruor · **Joined:** Apr 2006 **Posts:** 1999 **Location:**

TOloseGT wrote:

wow, what else is there to talk about? plvling is obviously legit cuz joymax has never banned a single person for being plvled.

Do not confuse legitimacy with legality.

Legality is determined by authority. Legitimacy is determined by the people.

Things can be legal without being legitimate and things can also be legitimate without being legal.

TOloseGT · **Joined:** Sep 2006 **Posts:** 7129 **Location:**

oh yea, broaden the term more, the 50000 ppl over there haven't described what legit means yet.

this thread went nowhere the 1st page, it won't go newhere the 50th page either.

arctic197 · **Posted:** Fri Oct 12, 2007 8:54 am

Sure it's legit. So powerleveling = legit. No question there.

Now, is getting powerleveled by bot equal to legit? Since getting powerleveled by bot is getting powerleveled nonetheless.

PR0METHEUS · **Joined:** Aug 2006 **Posts:** 4093 **Location:** Earth

the_wicked wrote:

can someone just lock the thread or something =_=

Yeah I agree it probably should be locked. We've gone in circles so many times already. Just about everything that could be said was said. Power leveling is legal, some people feel it is legit, some people feel it isn't. It's determined by the people. It's not exactly fair, but some don't care.

Will we see page 9?

roflcopter · **Joined:** Jan 2007 **Posts:** 619 **Location:**

Yes it should be locked but its interesting to try and determine exactly what impact power levelling has on this game compared to botting. What is clear that people hold opinions on subjects and cant handle it when people dont agree and will not abide by them, then we end up with threds gettin out of hand.

Obviousley a serious amount of people are against the whole power levelling route and id be interested to know what the powers that be @ SRF think about the whole situation. After all these forums are percieved as the 'Legits' place to come hang out and discuss the game and such things. So lets say someone like SG decided that power levelling was not amoungst the things that make you legit and thus started banning people for ' power levelling admittance '. It just appears to be such a grey area, with no word from Joymax on the situation you can only deduce that its perfectly acceptable to be power levelled!

rek · **Posted:** Fri Oct 12, 2007 10:53 am

If you get plvld, your still legit. Your just a lazy mofo.

Twist · **Posted:** Fri Oct 12, 2007 10:55 am

reK wrote:

If you get plvld, your still legit. Your just a lazy mofo.

+999999999....K lock now. :twisted:

Zing · **Joined:** Dec 2006 **Posts:** 568 **Location:**

Cruor wrote:

Do not confuse legitimacy with legality.

Legality is determined by authority. Legitimacy is determined by the people.

Things can be legal without being legitimate and things can also be legitimate without being legal.

Wow. And where do you get your definitions of words? You're mixing legitimate with moral. It's legal, but morally wrong. Not: it's legal, but legitimately wrong.

I suggest you to read the definitions of legitimacy if you haven't all ready.

mahumps · **Joined:** Feb 2007 **Posts:** 1715 **Location:**

I think if someone was plvl buy a friend or guildy and the plvler is not using anykind of bot it's legit but if someone bought the powerlevel using real money then i say that's not being legit..

dhevskie · **Joined:** Jul 2007 **Posts:** 155 **Location:**

dhevskie wrote:

roflcopter wrote:

I dont understand what being pwr lvl'd has got to do with not being legit. Ive seen this mentioned various times over the past few weeks. Yes perhaps if said person got pwr lvl'd by someone who was 'afk' then i can see where the problem arises, but still, the person not using the 3rd party programme is not actually breaking the rules.

The way the exp share system works and the exp penalty for the lvl gaps shows that its perfectly acceptable for someone to be pwr lvl'd. I honestly dont understand what its got to do with not being legit, maybe im wrong and id like people to make their point without de-railing the entire thread and rinsing out the same old discussion.

I just want to discuss the issue of being pwr lvl'd. The game mechanism allows it, so whats the big deal?

i have no idea, but to me being legit means 100% personal manual grind and anything otherwise is not legit, thats my own opinion, anyone being powerleveled is lazy he dont grind himself, these kind of people are prone to botting, why simply coz they dont have the will do it themselves, too lazy, so if no one will powerlevel em they probably be tempted to bot, lolz, lazy

ok so i will come down to the truth, in my opinion im negative on being powerleveled, but if someone, friend or guildmate offers to power level me for free, what the heck i will definintely say yes, im just trying to be honest, being powerleveled is not a game crime ya know, we just have diffrent opinions, though im negative does not mean i condem it, no, hell anyone wants to powerlevel me, hell i will say yes anytime of the day, honestly speaking

the stated statements above are may own personal opinion and does not reflect the opinion of others, its just a thougt, so anyone want to help, their friends power then go, but id say your still lazy

its just my opinion no offense intended, peace to ya all

Cruor · **Joined:** Apr 2006 **Posts:** 1999 **Location:**

Zing wrote:

Wow. And where do you get your definitions of words? You're mixing legitimate with moral. It's legal, but morally wrong. Not: it's legal, but legitimately wrong.

I suggest you to read the definitions of legitimacy if you haven't all ready.

Sometimes you have to look further than a dictionary.

Here is what Dr. Carl Q. Christol, Distinguished Professor Emeritus of International Law and Political Science at the University of Southern California, Los Angeles has to say about legitimacy in his paper Law and Legitimacy: The Iraq War:

Dr. Carl Q. Christol wrote:

An understanding of the relationship between law and legitimacy calls for acceptance of the proposition there may be both legitimate and illegitimate laws. Such a dichotomy in a democracy would seem to be impossible, particularly where there is a tradition that appropriately enacted statutes by a duly constituted public body, subject to judicial review, will cleanse away any condition or concern of illegitimacy and that there will be an informed understanding and broadly based public support, measured in public opinion, thereby producing also a legitimate law.

This approach, with its need to substantiate or to demonstrate that law is justified or approved is based on the view that laws result from accepted practices and seek to serve socially desirable goals. Illegitimate laws, on the other hand, could be the product of dictatorial regimes in totalitarian countries where socially desirable values may be of little consequence. Public support in a dictatorship would have little meaning to the Head of State. Illegitimate laws may also result, as has been claimed, when they depend on personal moral values of influential leaders, even in a democracy.

In a democracy, it is assumed that all laws will be legitimate due to a rule of the people. Our relationship with Joymax is certainly not a democracy however. Because we have no say in their laws they can be likened to a dictatorial regime. Illegitimate laws can be the product of a dictatorial regime. Therefore, the legitimacy of what Joymax does and does not define as legal can be questioned.

If public opinion dictates legitimacy, then it could be said that powerleveling is indeed legitimate because it is deemed acceptable by the majority of the public, or at least by the majority of the people in this community. I agree with that. But I will not agree with the view that legality automatically leads to legitimacy. For example, if botting suddenly became legal, I have issues believing that it would immediately also become legitimate within this community.

Morality is a bit different from legality and legitimacy. Although morality can be seen from a group perspective, it can also be scaled down to a personal perspective, unlike legitimacy. Something can be immoral to an individual within a group even when the group deems it to be legitimate. Although I cannot call powerleveling illegitimate, I can still call it immoral based on my personal beliefs.

It is true that legitimacy is being confused with morality in this topic, but not by me.

Zing · **Joined:** Dec 2006 **Posts:** 568 **Location:**

Okay, sure in political science. But you can't disregard the definitions from the dictionary just because another source for another different definition says otherwise.

Legitimacy in political science is, of course, the popular acceptance of a law or governing regime as an authority. In essence, morality comes hand in hand.

I'll break it down. Laws are based off of morals as I said earlier. In an acceptance or objection through majority population, it becomes a moral issue. If you were to dislike a law for some reason, it is because your morals conflicts with it. When a majority of people's morals conflict with a law, (in political science) it becomes an legitimacy issue. Thus, morality is to be linked with political science's legitimacy and compared.

Back to what I said: "You're mixing legitimate with moral. It's legal, but morally wrong. Not: it's legal, but legitimately wrong."

What I said is pretty much what I am saying now. But the only thing different is that I didn't know you were talking about political science. That error is at my fault.

All we're doing now is playing word games.

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